Comments on: Maureen Govern says, “So long, and thanks for all the fish.” http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/ Everything that comes out of Dossy, from the strange to the banal. Fri, 27 Jan 2012 14:30:11 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Dossy http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-456 Dossy Thu, 07 Sep 2006 18:36:54 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-456 Rick, never forget our insanely litigious society. An admission of guilt means doom if it comes to defending any lawsuits that arise from this. An abrupt resignation is not an admission of guilt. You might want to infer it, but it's just not the same thing, legally. (Of course, IANAL, but anyway.) I'm not so interested in assigning blame or determining guilt, here. (Else, I risk violating serious employee guidelines, I bet.) I just wanted to express my sadness that Maureen Govern is now gone and that I feel the way the whole incident was handled could have turned out much, much better than it had. Rick, never forget our insanely litigious society. An admission of guilt means doom if it comes to defending any lawsuits that arise from this. An abrupt resignation is not an admission of guilt. You might want to infer it, but it’s just not the same thing, legally. (Of course, IANAL, but anyway.)

I’m not so interested in assigning blame or determining guilt, here. (Else, I risk violating serious employee guidelines, I bet.) I just wanted to express my sadness that Maureen Govern is now gone and that I feel the way the whole incident was handled could have turned out much, much better than it had.

]]> By: Rick Gutleber http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-455 Rick Gutleber Thu, 07 Sep 2006 18:25:09 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-455 As with any highly public firings, I have to wonder if she was canned because it was specifically her policies, or lack thereof, that caused the problem (I have to think this went through a lot of people before it happened), or is AOL just throwing someone under the bus to look like they are taking this seriously? I have no doubts that they _are_ taking the problem seriously, but I'm really starting to wonder about this knee-jerk reaction to fire someone up high when something goes wrong... whatever happened to making the person repsonsible (or not, who knows?) fix the problem? If she personally okayed the release or made a policy that permitted the release to happen, yeah, there's culpability, but it seems to me it was quite possible that this happened without her explicit knowledge... I don't know either way. As with any highly public firings, I have to wonder if she was canned because it was specifically her policies, or lack thereof, that caused the problem (I have to think this went through a lot of people before it happened), or is AOL just throwing someone under the bus to look like they are taking this seriously?

I have no doubts that they _are_ taking the problem seriously, but I’m really starting to wonder about this knee-jerk reaction to fire someone up high when something goes wrong… whatever happened to making the person repsonsible (or not, who knows?) fix the problem?

If she personally okayed the release or made a policy that permitted the release to happen, yeah, there’s culpability, but it seems to me it was quite possible that this happened without her explicit knowledge… I don’t know either way.

]]> By: stew http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-454 stew Mon, 28 Aug 2006 18:44:56 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-454 oh my dont cry for me argentina!!!!! what the heckm is your problem the data of thousands is leaked an you wail what a fine person she is? are you serious? the damage is immense consider the possibilities? as you see dont reach me at aol any more? I was listed in the leak!!! oh my dont cry for me argentina!!!!!

what the heckm is your problem the data of thousands is leaked an you wail what a fine person she is? are you serious? the damage is immense consider the possibilities? as you see dont reach me at aol any more?

I was listed in the leak!!!

]]> By: patrick http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-453 patrick Mon, 28 Aug 2006 01:31:26 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-453 To tell you the truth as AOL is an IPO company, it had to make big public sacrifices. An Architect, a VP and CTO is about as big as you can get, if AOL was not an IPO- then it would be a different story I'm sure. It is a shame to see the upper echelons go, I think Maureen was making some good decisions. But someone had to take responsibility for this. It was a screw up that should have never happened. Do the consequences of actions merit the level of discipline taken, or does the level conscious effort taken within the action merit it? If a physicist spills coffee on the control panel of a nuclear reactor, and sets of a major disaster- Do you let him/her keep their job because it was an accident or do you fire them for being stupid in having coffee around the panel in the first place and for causing such a disaster? To tell you the truth as AOL is an IPO company, it had to make big public sacrifices. An Architect, a VP and CTO is about as big as you can get, if AOL was not an IPO- then it would be a different story I’m sure.

It is a shame to see the upper echelons go, I think Maureen was making some good decisions.

But someone had to take responsibility for this. It was a screw up that should have never happened.

Do the consequences of actions merit the level of discipline taken, or does the level conscious effort taken within the action merit it?

If a physicist spills coffee on the control panel of a nuclear reactor, and sets of a major disaster- Do you let him/her keep their job because it was an accident or do you fire them for being stupid in having coffee around the panel in the first place and for causing such a disaster?

]]> By: John http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-452 John Thu, 24 Aug 2006 17:20:00 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-452 It's not easy to fire a "C-level" executive. Maureen's background is in telecom, not internet. With AOL moving away from selling dial up and walled garden and becoming a portal play (to compete with Google and Yahoo), I wonder if she already hadn't been given walking papers and this was a great excuse to accelerate the process and make AOL look pro-active on this privacy issue. Not her fault, but AOL decided to move in a different strategic direction after they hired her and her skills / background don’t exactly match up with the new direction. It’s not easy to fire a “C-level” executive. Maureen’s background is in telecom, not internet. With AOL moving away from selling dial up and walled garden and becoming a portal play (to compete with Google and Yahoo), I wonder if she already hadn’t been given walking papers and this was a great excuse to accelerate the process and make AOL look pro-active on this privacy issue. Not her fault, but AOL decided to move in a different strategic direction after they hired her and her skills / background don’t exactly match up with the new direction.

]]> By: Dossy http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-451 Dossy Thu, 24 Aug 2006 14:00:13 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-451 Julio, lack of success should be enough of a consequence. Julio, lack of success should be enough of a consequence.

]]> By: Julio Hernandez-Miyares http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-450 Julio Hernandez-Miyares Thu, 24 Aug 2006 11:59:39 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-450 The effect of the CTO's departure on the willingness of folks to continue to take calculated risks will depend on those people's innate predisposition to risk. It will not affect mine and I suspect it would not affect yours. If your premise around risk taking is that when it backfires badly there are no consequences, then I am not sure what world you are living in or what kind of organization you want to be apart of. The effect of the CTO’s departure on the willingness of folks to continue to take calculated risks will depend on those people’s innate predisposition to risk. It will not affect mine and I suspect it would not affect yours. If your premise around risk taking is that when it backfires badly there are no consequences, then I am not sure what world you are living in or what kind of organization you want to be apart of.

]]> By: Dossy http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-449 Dossy Wed, 23 Aug 2006 15:35:54 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-449 <i>"[...] I assume you're still with the company and your "clearing of the office" is not a permenant goodbye."</i> You never can tell what the future may bring, though. “[...] I assume you’re still with the company and your “clearing of the office” is not a permenant goodbye.”

You never can tell what the future may bring, though.

]]> By: Shawn Christopher http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-448 Shawn Christopher Wed, 23 Aug 2006 15:28:16 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-448 Dossy, Yeah I kinda play a neutral card in all this as I didn't know her. However yeah it's always good to wish someone well :). Considering you call her "our ex-CTO" I assume you're still with the company and your "clearing of the office" is not a permenant goodbye. I've emailed you. Dossy,
Yeah I kinda play a neutral card in all this as I didn’t know her. However yeah it’s always good to wish someone well :) . Considering you call her “our ex-CTO” I assume you’re still with the company and your “clearing of the office” is not a permenant goodbye.

I’ve emailed you.

]]> By: Dossy http://dossy.org/2006/08/maureen-govern-says-so-long-and-thanks-for-all-the-fish/comment-page-1/#comment-447 Dossy Tue, 22 Aug 2006 20:18:16 +0000 http://dossy.org/archives/000325.html#comment-447 The data was definitely not released by accident, sure. But, I think the manner in which the data was made avaialble (open to general public, perhaps not properly sanitized, etc.) was an honest mistake and not intended to violate anyone's privacy. People in business do stupid stuff <b>all the time</b> but the current culture only penalizes them when the mistakes are public in nature. Of course, in a large Internet company like AOL, the biggest rewards come with the biggest risks: those which have a public impact. Harsher consequences for public mistakes doesn't encourage the kind of innovation that's required to pull AOL out of its hole. In short, yeah, I'd rather a culture that doesn't discourage folks from trying to do the right thing, even if it means failing every now and then. The data was definitely not released by accident, sure. But, I think the manner in which the data was made avaialble (open to general public, perhaps not properly sanitized, etc.) was an honest mistake and not intended to violate anyone’s privacy.

People in business do stupid stuff all the time but the current culture only penalizes them when the mistakes are public in nature. Of course, in a large Internet company like AOL, the biggest rewards come with the biggest risks: those which have a public impact. Harsher consequences for public mistakes doesn’t encourage the kind of innovation that’s required to pull AOL out of its hole.

In short, yeah, I’d rather a culture that doesn’t discourage folks from trying to do the right thing, even if it means failing every now and then.

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